Terrified of intimacy; 5 years of mixed sig Can I still tell him I love him?

Breakup Help reconciliation
61

there’s this little voice inside me… maybe that’s my gut. i used to trust it; i no longer do. or at least i don’t want to. throughout these past 5 years, no matter how bad things seemed - when he stopped responding to my calls, when he was seeing his ex, when we ignored each other in public for a year, when he was interacting with me but still seeing her - that little voice always said, “it’s not over. there was and will be something important between you.” i spent three years in therapy learning how to trust my instincts (that he had feelings for me) and take responsibility for my actions (my hot and cold mixed signals in the past and in the present; his reaction to my behavior). But now it all feels like a lie. now i see his actions towards me these past two years (since we reconnected) as him only enjoying my company. I even re-read my original post here and want to cry from humiliation; it seems obvious to me now that he was just being friendly and never wanted anything deeper.

so i want to write him off. but there’s still that little voice inside of me. it doesn’t say “he’s the one” or “it’s not over” anymore (or maybe it does but i refuse to listen to it). instead it says, “this is a mistake.” As in, it’s a mistake to write him off without talking to him. So I’ll talk to him. I even think I know what I’ll say. But as I said before, I just don’t know when.

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I’m really sorry that it has come to all this. What is done is done my dear. We all are a work in progress, we are always learning and figuring stuff out as we go. Don’t torture yourself over it.

I think there is a 3rd option here. That he will want to give it a chance but in the end things might not work anyway. So keep your mind open and think that at least you won’t be stuck anymore. As for when to tell him, you also know where he is. I would say give yourself a break for now. To settle your thoughts down. But put a deadline or else time will just pass by, on and on, and you’ll keep delaying. I would say one-two weeks maximum. During this time, do something different. Wake-up meditate for 10 minutes, go to a dance class (or some other form of exercise), prepare yourself a yummy breakfast. At the end of the day have a nice bath with candles and a book. Just something to calm your mind, and balance your energies. I feel you are so so down my dear. You need to get your strength back up, and to set yourself free. You’ve been afraid all this time of many things, to the point of shutting yourself to others around. Listen to podcasts, read books. Something to help you get out of the mentality you’ve been in for so long. It’s difficult, but not impossible. I had to force myself to get out of where I was and I was able to, you are too :slight_smile:

For starters, check this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tH1_agS2P5k I love what he says in chapter 1. I listened to that several times and it would calm me down and get into an almost transe like state everytime. Just calm, living the present, accepting.

If you want a way for us to talk more regularly let me know and we can exchange FBs or something. I know sometimes you need someone to really talk to, not just write a message and then wait for hours or days for a reply

63

Thank you so much for being so kind and supportive, Kaila. I’ve been trying to do what you suggested - taking care of me first and foremost. I’ve just booked a trip to Milan with some friends for the Expo and I’ve been buying a lot of new clothes and getting rid of old ones. I’ve been sleeping a lot and just kind of keeping to myself. I think I’m really starting to accept that he moved on a long time ago and now only sees me as a friend; that I most likely magnified his positive attentions towards me and any weirdness probably had nothing to do with me.

That said, he and I had a totally random, totally unexpected encounter tonight. I was feeling upset since yesterday afternoon because a friend told me that he had seen him rollerblading with “some woman… not his ex”. But today I ran into him on the street and after we had clowned around a bit, he asked if I wanted to go have a gelato with him. We ended up going to our favorite bar and getting wasted together, along with a friend of his who I hate but finally made peace with tonight.

The waitress was hanging out with us and he was flirting with her a lot. She is very sweet and very, very young - even younger than his ex (who is 13 years younger than him). At one point, after we were all pretty wasted, he insisted we go have dinner at his friend’s house. He, his friend (my former enemy) and I went to the friend’s house and F made us dinner. Had you told me this morning that F would cook me dinner at my former enemy’s house I would have said you were insane. It made me feel nostalgic for the times F came to my house and cooked me dinner. Over the pasta I said to him, “life is strange.”

After we ate we all went back to the bar and drank and hung out with various people until 3 in the morning. I’m almost positive he went home with the waitress. I don’t love it, I feel a bit sad thinking about it now, but I’m not devastated. She was very sweet but she doesn’t have much to say that’s interesting; maybe that’s really his type.

It was a warm, fun, friendly encounter. He did say something that I liked: as I was saying goodnight to him (the waitress and some other people were next to him) I thanked him for having kidnapped me on the street and for having shown me a really random unexpected evening. Someone interrupted me and F said, “Quiet! She’s laying down some real truth here!”

I asked, “What do you mean?”

And he said, “Tonight. What you were saying earlier about life being strange. But, you know, everything happens for a reason. And I think tonight was long overdue/what we needed” (translating roughly)

One of the people next to us said, “What do you mean?”

F said, “She knows exactly what I mean. It’s… it’s between us.”

Well, whatever he meant, he was flirting with the waitress all night long and most likely took her home. Perhaps mild flirting with me? Smiling at me warmly a lot. No… better not to go down that road. I don’t love that he was flirting with her in front of me but… well, I guess that just helps hit home that he only sees me as a friend. Which I think I can finally accept.

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It’s 5:30 in the morning and I’m wide awake.

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Oh, two random things:

While F and I were chatting with his friend, the bar owner came over to sit with us. The bar owner said, “Oh, F is such a great guy. But he can’t have women. He has no clue how to keep them.” F just kind of laughed it off but I thought it was an odd thing for the bar owner to say.

While F and I were at his friend’s house, the friend was getting drunk and kept forgetting my name (my real one, that is). And randomly, he called me Penelope!

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Kaila? Ikkemarl? Starlight?

67

is that a nickname? or this website is the only place you call yourself Penelope? honestly I personally think the only way to ever move forward and the only thing left to do is to have a heart to heart. just lay it all down for him. write it down and read from it so you say all that you want to say if that helps or just write down bullet points and then watever he decides you move forward with that. cause the owner saying that means it’s not easy for him … it should show you that he is also struggling and there’s no pointing fingers. that’s all the past just talk to him . if you guys are gonna b friends then let it be clear instead of the hot and colds he gives you. I’m seriously rooting for you guys! but you gotta talk to him

68

Penelope is the name I use here; Penelope, the wife of ulysses who waited for him to return for 20 years even when everyone in her life told her he was dead and she was crazy…

Well, I guess I am crazy after all. I did try to talk to him. I decided to use his final words to me as a jumping board to invite him to dinner at my house. After all, what else could he have meant by “life is strange, we didn’t run into each other today by chance, it was destiny, and it was really needed. you know what I mean. it’s something between you and me. do you understand what I’m talking about?”? I didn’t dare to hope for anything romantic behind his words, but at the very least I thought he meant that he’d had as much fun with me that night as I had had with him and that he’d be open to having dinner with me at my place.

There was a concert. He was happy to see me; he brought up our crazy night a few times: “You and I opened the fifth portal Monday night! We visited the seventh dimension!”, but he was flirting hardcore with the 25 year-old waitress. I started to feel heartsick and ridiculous but I made myself talk to him anyway. I said, “Hey, listen… I was thinking about what you said at the end of the other night about destiny and nothing happening by chance and I agree with you and I’d hate for it to take another 5 years before we -”

“Rescued someone?” he said. I was completely confused.

He said that his spiel about destiny and nothing happening by chance was about his friend, who had been having a bad day and needed “Rescuing.”

As you can imagine, my face dropped. He said, “why, what did you think I was talking about?” I said, “I was clearly mistaken.”

He said, “Oh, I think I knew what you meant… well, anyway, yeah, life is strange, the situation was strange, but all the events happened and contributed to that one end.”

I said, “If you had told me that morning that you were going to cook me dinner at that guy’s house I’d have said -”

He interrupted me: “Unlikely!”

“Impossible,” I said. “It had been five years since I’d had your cooking…”

“Yeah, well, don’t forget, I’m the best chef in town!”

I think I looked upset because he reached out and rubbed my arm reassuringly. Then he turned to talk to someone else. I wished everyone a good night and went home. I passed him on the way out of the parking lot and said goodnight one more time, cheerfully, so that he didn’t think I was sulking. I noticed he was leaving alone on his scooter; the waitress was heading to her car with another guy. He told me, “I’m going to go make two [didn’t understand what he said] and go home!” Great.

I drove home myself. Burst into tears as soon as I got in the door.

Business as usual. Picking up the pieces as usual.

69

well that friend might know about this website then… so you asked him to have dinner and he declined?

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They don’t know about this, they don’t speak English. Penelope is a common enough name here.

I tried to ask him to dinner but he cut me off at the pass before I could even ask him. I tried to use what he’d said about our fun, unexpected encounter on Monday being destiny and fate as a jumping off point but he claimed that he’d been talking about his drunken friend, who needed us to rescue him from a bad mood.

I’m left, as always, wondering if I’m crazy.

He didn’t even let me ask.

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One thing I am glad about, though, is that I tried to get up the nerve to ask, anyway. And - I know it might sound strange - but I’m glad I let him see that I was upset and disappointed. I usually work hard to hide my feelings from him, and ever since that crap with his ex last July, I’ve been swallowing my heartbreak to keep our relationship consistently friendly. But the other night I let him see that he can affect me negatively. That he can hurt me. I don’t think he’s ever known that.

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By the way? I don’t even know his stupid drunk friend. Why the hell would he need both of us to “save” him? That guy is a career drunk. A stupid plate of pasta isn’t going to save him. He meant to tell me that he bumped into me on the street that afternoon and asked me to get gelato with him was all destined to help this guy I don’t even know?

In one fell swoop, he reduced the whole fun day to nothing. Maybe that’s what it’s always been to him - nothing. Maybe it’s just time to face the fact that I’ve been dreaming alone for five years.

73

ohhhhh okay… sounds like a cute idea but you might just want to be straightforward. just go up to him say hi and say you want him to come to dinner with you… it’s important. just “reap the bandage off” lol good luck

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well, not tonight. tonight was not great. i went to an event, knowing he’d be there working the sound. i’ve been so tied in knots these past few days… i don’t think i realized how angry i was, or, i guess, how much anger i’ve been holding on to since last july when he started pushing me away by being cruel after having let me feel close to him again. When I saw him I had every intention of being friendly and nice, to smile through the pain and keep the status quo, but he passed by me and pretended not to see me! I lost it; i reached out and tagged him and said, “yo!” He stopped and smiled and kissed me on the cheek and to my shock, i muttered: “idiot.”

He looked at me in surprise, but was grinning widely when he said, “Hey!!!” I grinned, too, and he went back to his soundbooth. I couldn’t believe that word had popped out! I’m so ashamed. Later, he was walking by me again and he smiled at me and tapped me on the arm so it doesn’t seem like he was upset… but i feel like a prize jerk. i’ve been trying so hard for the past few months to hide my pain and anger from him - to be a grown up - and in that one word, my anger came out. I also saw him flirting with some other random trashy looking woman and bring her to his soundbooth with him! What the hell! But I didn’t stop there! I then got drunk and hung out with my guy friends, including one who most people in town think I have something with. I flirted with them openly; something I never do. He was dancing with a friend; so cute. I just kept getting madder and madder at myself. I didn’t engage with him for the rest of the evening (i figured it was wiser, since i was drunk).

On our way out of the bar, we passed F’s drunk friend, the one we “saved” the
other night. I stopped to say hi to him. He said something interesting. He said, “Yeah, the other night when you guys came to my house to make me dinner… I don’t know what that was about. THat was all you guys, I was fine, I didn’t want you guys to come over.”

“Oh, really?” I said. “Because F said it was all about you, that it was what you needed.”

“That’s ridiculous,” said the guy.

“Well, one of you is lying,” I said playfully.

“Then it was probably because… well, never mind. It’s not important.”

I still feel bad about what I said. It wasn’t classy or grown up. He seemed to be taking it as a joke - anyway, I’m a stupid foreigner, I mix words up all the time - but I still feel embarrassed and bad. Then again, he’s been such a jerk to me so many times in the distant and recent past…

Whatever.

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I do think you are getting yourself riled up for the wrong reasons. I do think he really truly cares for you but you won’t go after him in a clear way to find out

76

I honestly believe I can help with some advice my story is a bit long as yours as well. I get tired of trying to help others when only to hear them say I do not care in the end but if you really believe there is something. I mean really now today it is about I want I want and no work. I am not saying you are bad what I am saying is if you are willing to do the work I can give you the help you need I gave everything to be with her and I lost it. However I picked myself up working two jobs and going overseas again for her and to keep going. That is love because I want a home. I have a place to sleep but that is not home just shelter. So if you are willing to do this contact me and I can email you my story and go from there. Anything is possible. Really is.

77

Yeah, last night was a total bust, a total missed opportunity. He was there and the waitress was elsewhere, at work so i could have just had a nice fun time with him but instead i completely dropped the ball. I’m so ashamed. I think i really jumped the gun, too; maybe he wasn’t even pretending he didn’t see me. I really lost it. I’m angry and hurt right now but i don’t want to tell him mean things, i want to tell him wonderful things.

My friend didn’t help. She thinks i’m just crazy and see things that aren’t there so having her whisper in my ear, “stop looking at him. Stop dreaming” was not conducive to my well being.

I feel so ashamed of my behavior.

I swing so hard between thinking he cares and tjinking, as all my friends do, that i’m nothing to him.

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I dont want this love to go away I have been there in fact overseas and I messed up and alone but I keep going on I have a long story to tell but you need help and I want to help you can contact me at

-Time goes forward never backwards. The clock is ticking.

79

Hey Penelope! Im so so sorry I went abroad and only came back yesterday! How are you feeling today my dear?

Wow… Well I don’t know if I’m thinking too much myself but, it seems like maybe that night was one of three things:

  1. He wanted to spend more time with you and cook for you for old times sake and found an excuse. Then he was drunk, and when you are drunk you are just honest. So he said those things, and the “this is what we needed” could have meant to get closer again. But then next time, he made it sound like something else, because who knows why… maybe fear, maybe regretting have lead you on
  2. He said that “this is what we needed” meaning to settle things as friends.
  3. Just meant what he said, or the fact that you and that guy stopped being enemies.

As hard as it can be and as much as he seems to be avoiding everything, I think somehow you still need to have a final talk. But the way he acted towards you when you tried to invite him for dinner, doesn’t give me much hope. So keep thinking about a way out, a new life, something, so that you can close this chapter. Then talk to him, sit down with him, and if he interrupts say “please don’t interrupt me” and make sure you say what you want to say

80

Hi, Kaila… welcome back. I hope you had a great time, I hope it was a vacation and that you met interesting people…

Thank you as always for your input. I’m not doing too great right now. I’m more upset, actually, about what I did Saturday night; I think my behavior was childish and tacky. I know that I had been repressing a lot of anger over the way he’s treated me this past summer. The sight of him frolicking with that young waitress in front of me and the way he minimized our fun day sent me over the edge, I guess, but that’s still no excuse. I’m mad that I lost control after having been so good about behaving like an adult even though I felt heartbroken. I was so shocked when I heard that word come out of my mouth! It was the last thing I’d expected to say. I’m afraid that this will kick off another of our cold, horrible periods. Why does this always have to freaking happen - every SINGLE time we have fun together and feel closer, one of us has to wreck it?